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Hudson and Fournier: Catholic Countdown to Election 2012, Day 27. Debating the Obama Catholics Comments

Over the past few years, both of us have been thrust into debates with various Obama surrogates. Whether on radio, TV, or in print, the experience is disconcerting and would be dispiriting if it were not, at times, so humorous.  Continue Reading

1 - 10 of 16 Comments

  1. Judy Claar
    2 years ago

    Hi Rob! I addressed that issue to you on another post. Me, the "war hound", Ha! Blessings...

  2. Rob
    2 years ago

    You are right Judy, RR is for life, except for those darn exceptions that keep the whole machine running. I think the reveral of the Mexico City policy is the most you can expect.

  3. vance
    2 years ago

    Great article. All your points hit the nail on the head. The Party of Death and Deceit have used their Catholic in name only surrogates for years to deceive Catholics to stay in the ranks of the Party. Worse yet is that we have many Carol Keehan's among the Bishops and clergy. Bishop Stephen Blaire of Stockton, California is a prime example. He and his ilk are worse than surrogates.

  4. Judy Claar
    2 years ago

    Almeras, Very astute. I agree with what you said. I do not know that our brothers and sisters know what an evil Obamacare is. Romney has to Win before he can Do Anything. And you are correct Almeras, I think in the order you listed priorities. That is the order Most of the people voting will vote for, besides our enormous bill to China...R/R knows what they must preach and do first to become elected. That is the Goal, Right To Lifer's...for R/R to be elected. Therefore, Catholics must vote R/R because he is for Life. The other opponent is O/B, The Culture of Death. Romney knows that this country is more than half past Death...and its mesmerized followers are too. So he has to gather his votes on All fronts. Our Right To Life is on the brink of Death if Obama wins. Perhaps Dead. That is Fact. We must be patient. If R/R wins, and as he makes more people happy, R/R will have a chance to repeal Obamacare, which in turn will stop some killings, and the Mandate. R/R will have accomplished a lot! if one compares that to where we are now falling headlong into the deepest abyss that you can imagine. Prayerful Blessings...

    We remain Persistence in Prayer. The Rosary. The Eucharist, and Holy Mother Church. And remember, that God acts and answers in His own Time. We are not foreseers of the future. He is.The 2,000 years since Christ was here, is only like 2 days to Him. Our hearts are different...mine, tells me to follow R/R. Prayerful Blessings...

  5. Paul-Emile Leray
    2 years ago

    What is one reason why politicians spend so much time campaigning on university campuses and inside large stadiums? It is not only about facilities capable of holding large crowds. Demagogues inside mobocracies like to work crowds who are impressionable, easily molded and influenced. Why do they spend so much time targeting young voters? One reason is that many of these youth are naive ideology based impressionable gullible minds easily swayed by sophistry, sensationalism, platitudes, tone, style, presentation, to name but a few examples. The more lost a democracy is, the more fertile the ground for demagogues to rise to power and/or maintain it if they are already in power. Politicians will lead you off a cliff like lemmings if you do not watch them. How to reconcile the fact that it is the nature of truth that it often separates itself from the crowd with the other fact that in a democracy majority opinion has much weight? The majority is often, if not usually, wrong. Let us see what happens next, in a sphere where sophistry often seems to have too much influence in part due to the non critical thinking of the collective whole of the citizenry.
    Paul-Emile Leray

  6. Sum Nemo
    2 years ago

    Based upon the articles I see at this website, Catholic Online is now "Republican Online" and it is becoming increasingly clear that if I do not vote Republican, I am not a "true" catholic and, according to some, should be excommunicated. While I will not vote for Obama, I am equally adamant against Romney and the Republican Party. Our two-party system has failed ingloriously, but we, being the sheep that we are, are too lazy to do the work necessary to bring a viable alternative to the ballot. Instead, we would rather waste valuable time posting our rancor at each other on these "forums". I was told as a child that there is a direct correlation between effort and results. If Obama or Romney, Democrat or Republican, is the best we can do, or the best we are willing to accept, we deserve no better.

    By the way, I am in agreement with Mr. McGuire. Even more, I see nothing written at this website anymore that would be conducive to encouraging constructive dialogue (Maybe this website is "Republican Online" in Catholic clothing). I guess the question becomes do we really want to work out our differences and find common ground for the good of all or are we satisfied to engage in sanctimonious behavior, shaking our fists at one another?

  7. Rush Glick
    2 years ago

    Sometimes pointed, blunt, to-the-point words are necessary tools during times of trial. The Catholic Church is currently under a direct attack through the HHS mandate. To soften words at such a time as this will serve only those who wish to have the government gain a surer foothold upon the precious ground of our fundamental constitutional right to religious freedom. Sadly, this was, I feel, brought to our doorstep through our own naive notion that government can provide the answers to society's ills - let "them" take care of it for us. How many in the Church, both lay and clergy, firmly embraced the notion of nationalized healthcare in the first place, even when we were told that we needed to hurry and pass it so we find out what was actually in the legislation? (Have any of us ever had a good result after buying a car in that manner?) We soon found out what lurked inside that Everestine document. The good news is that we can correct this very soon - November 6. One presidential candidate promises to end Obamacare, and with it the mandate, while the other will implement it. The choice is ours...

  8. Paul-Emile Leray
    2 years ago

    If it is difficult to discern who will do the most good, then ask who will likely do the least amount of harm. Campaigning and governing politicians resemble the Pharisees, often concerned more with the letter of the law and public image than with the pursuit of truth with an honest and sincere heart. Chaos is fertile ground for terrorists and demagogues to rise to power. Usually, a vibrant middle class is important for societal stability. What are some core issues facing the United States at present, both nationally and internationally? Who is most likely to work through the core issues following a peaceful process towards those ends? Catholic natural laws and positive laws (manmade); let us never forget that moral laws and positive laws often do not equate. Politicians mirror the collective consciousness and unconsciousness of the citizenry. Therefore, if the politicians are excellent, if they are horrid, if they are mediocre; in a democracy simply consider them as mirror reflections of the collective whole. Impressed? Not impressed? They mirror the collective whole, both in terms of consciousness/awareness and unconsciousness/unawareness. Critically analyze and listen for sophistic reasoning (much of it in politics is precisely that) during their debates and speeches. Are they appealing to the mob, using demagogic language? Are they making use of popular prejudices and false claims and promises to gain power? Are they giving the semblance of wisdom, without possessing the reality? (Sophistry) See the parallels between the Pharisees and the Politicians. Now, consider why so many martyrs died and why. Choose your politicians wisely, because they can do great damage (with YOUR money). Only naive fools would give them more trust than they merit, based on thousands of years of history the world over. Be critical, when voting. Flash? Drop it. Fancy suits? Who cares. Red and blue power and soft ties? See past it. Euphemistic language? See past it. Hand gestures? Never mind. Listen to what they are saying and are not saying. And treat them as YOUR servants, since they ARE. They work for YOU. They want their names in the history books? YOU, the citizenry, get to write their scripts. You are the directors, they are the actors on stage. YOU pull the strings, NOT them. They work for you. Do NOT put them on pedestals. They are human beings, nothing more and nothing less. Here is what they often do:
    1. Terrorize.
    2. Infantilize.
    3. Control.
    Fear turns people into frightened childlike sheoples who then often surrender too much of their FREE WILL to end up becoming controlled by at times tyrannical authoritarian autocratic types. Exercise your Christian free will and keep them as honest as possible. And NEVER trust a politician, 100%. Never be naive and gullible, including with politics and politicians. A well educated citizenry is also good for politicians, since it tends to assist political leaders to walk towards and on a higher road. (and one that is more narrow and straight as well, again, with YOUR money)
    Paul-Emile Leray

  9. Robert Green
    2 years ago

    There is NO such thing as a Roman Catholic Democrat!!!

    Section 2272 of the Catechism of the Catholic Church says:

    2272 Formal cooperation in an abortion constitutes a grave offense. The Church attaches the canonical penalty of excommunication to this crime against human life. "A person who procures a completed abortion incurs excommunication latae sententiae," "by the very commission of the offense," and subject to the conditions provided by Canon Law. The Church does not thereby intend to restrict the scope of mercy. Rather, she makes clear the gravity of the crime committed, the irreparable harm done to the innocent who is put to death, as well as to the parents and the whole of society.

    The key words are "Formal Cooperation!" You can't get much more formal than voting for or contributing to a political party or one of its members who have a Pro-Choice plank in their platform. Anyone claiming to be Catholic and supporting those that would perpetuate a Pro-Choice viewpoint cannot be Catholic. If you contribute to the Democrat Party, you support their view of Pro-Choice. If you vote for someone who claims to be Pro-Life within the Democrat Party, you vote for someone who will support Pro-Choice members of their party and make it impossible to ever eliminate abortion in this country. Giving aid and comfort to the enemy can be prosecuted as treason in this country. Why would you want to help those that would give aid and comfort to those that fight against one of the primary tenets of your faith? Life...from conception to natural death!

    I reiterate...There is no such thing as a Roman Catholic democrat! They are all excommunicated!

  10. JayKaye
    2 years ago

    How can the author of this article expect anyone to believe such hogwash. Depicting Obama as another Hitler is nothing more than another punch below-the-belt on partison basis, gone from mud-slinging to rock throwing.

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