71 - 80 of 136 Comments

1. Steve

   1 year ago

   Mormonism is surely a problem, and we need to educate our families and friends to their errors in theology. But there are two things to say about Romney that we know for sure.
   Unlike Obama, Romney is not a communist. And, again unlike Obama, Romney is not a dog eater!

2. Ed

   1 year ago

   While I am not enchanted with Mitt I am totally against the Obama policies - I will vote against Obama

3. ccs

   1 year ago

   @David L. - "That we do not agree with the Catholic Church on the specifics of the doctrine of the Trinity is the only real reason (that I am aware of) that our baptism is not considered acceptable." Unfortunately, you are dismissing as trivial the central tenet of true Christian faith. Christ's Incarnation and Atonement would be irrelevant if the entire universe was not created through Him, by Him, and for Him. What - precisely - do Mormons believe concerning the uniqueness and eternality of the Godhead? If your belief in the Trinity is significantly misaligned from that of the faith throughout the ages, then your baptism is invalid. You may be a very good person, and you may be following Natural Law to such an extent that God recognizes you as a sincere seeker of Truth - and He will reveal Himself to those who sincerely seek Him. But we as Catholics cannot call you a Christian.

4. ccs

   1 year ago

   @techwreck - "Catholics can't support upholding the Constitution while undermining it by disregarding its "no religious test" provision." Actually, that is not a logical application of the "no religious test" provision. "No religious test" applies only to whether or not it is legal for the government itself to apply a religious test to candidates. According to this Constitutional provision, the government cannot tell a Satanist or a radical Muslim or a member of any other religious organization (including the Catholic Church or the LDS) that the candidate's religion disqualifies him or her from holding public office. Individuals, however, are free to apply whatever tests they find appropriate, whether these tests are religious or otherwise. Would you vote for a Satanist? Would you vote for a radical Muslim? If not, then you as an individual are applying a religious test. Whether or not Catholics - as individuals - should apply that sort of test to a Mormon candidate is the topic of this article. Discussing that question is in no way undermining the Constitution.

5. I Believe In Jesus Christ

   1 year ago

   Mormons are Christians. As a Latter-day Saint, I have been taught, and have personally chosen, to accept Christ as my Savior. I am taught to follow Him and feast on His word. I have no qualms in insisting that real Mormons are Christians. We worship Christ and covenant to follow Him. We are baptized in His name to follow Him, we partake of the sacrament (the holy communion) weekly to remember the sacrifice of His blood and to remember His victory over death, we pray to the Father in His name, and we strive to obey Him, knowing that it is only through His merits and grace that we are saved. He is constantly held up in our meetings as our Savior, our Redeemer, our Lord, and the author of our faith and our salvation. We believe that He stands at the head of His living Church, leading it as in days of old through revelation to His prophets and apostles. The Christ we worship is the living Christ, the Son of God, foretold in the Old Testament, revealed in the New Testament, and affirmed in the Book of Mormon: Another Testament of Jesus Christ.David Jones needs be honest in his study and reporting of the Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter-day Saints more thoroughly before he makes such blatant false judgements about a Church he really knows very little about. Good Catholics need to unite with their Latter-day Saint brothers and sisters and elect an honest Christian to lead OUR country back to the values both Catholics and Mormons cherish and defend. America needs Mitt Romney and his leadership now more than ever!

6. ninov

   1 year ago

   Is Mormonism Christian is what I wish to address?
   
   Are Mormons pro-life – no idea. The Mormons I know and love are very pro-life but I know Protestants that are on both sides of the fence. This is a doctrine question for the Mormon faith and not a question for an individual Mormon. I know Catholics that are pro-abortion, those aren’t good Catholics. Maybe there are pro-abortion Mormons and they aren’t good Mormons. I would have to look that up in the Mormon doctrine. The Catholic doctrine in the Catechism (on line for anyone) CCC2270 is very clear. Any form of abortion is an intrinsic evil because the body and soul are created at conception (sperm meets egg) so it’s killing. Before I hit the Mormon Christian issue, how about voting?
   
   First, where is the author going? I will vote for Mitt over Obama. It's the lesser of two evils and anyone who studies the Catholic Church knows this is the position. Even if we were faced with two pro-abortion candidates, the Church still asks us to vote and analyze the candidates on different grounds and make the best choice. Not sit on our hands! Mitt says he’s prolife now, Obama is clearly pushing money at the abortion business to kill more babies. Seems like a clear choice on the life issue.
   CCC676 clearly states our salvation is not going to come through politics. So don’t stake your claim so heavily in the political area. This web site tends to do this. Politics is important, but not where our salvation is coming from or through.
   
   Is Mormonism Christian? The way to answer this is to say, who is asking the question. If you ask a Mormon, they say yes. If you ask a Catholic that truly understands Catholic history and how a Catholic defines Christianity, the answer is no, Mormons are not Christian by the Catholic definition. It’s a question of definition. One has to look at how Catholics define a Christian. First, Mormons believe that the Trinity is three individual people. This is completely against the teachings of Augustine, early Christian fathers, etc. The Trinity, as the traditional definition is 3 person in one nature. Nature can be translated also as being. Being is a loaded word. Volumes of information has been written on this word. And entire branch of philosophy (Metaphysics) has been written on this word - being. If you compare being and how the Catholic Church envisions Father, Son and Holy Spirit, and how the Mormons see this, they are different. This is why the Catholic Church does not consider Mormonism Christian. Protestant and Orthodox faith communities do believe this, which is why the Catholic Church DOES consider them Christian but they live outside the visible boundary of the church. Most Catholics in the US live outside the visible boundaries of the church as well as they are in a state of mortal sin in various ways. Very sad but likely true. Contraception, abortion, unrepentant mortal sins, never attend confession or very little, missing Mass on Sunday, etc.
   To go into detail on the ontological (another word not used and study anymore) meaning of the word being and trinity would take weeks to months. But how the two organizations define Christianity is indeed different and thus, a Catholic would not consider a Mormon Christian.
   
   The Mormon doctrine can define itself however it wishes and other groups, IE, they can consider Catholics Christian, but the Catholic doctrine is clear, Mormons are not Christian.
   Here is another reason they are not. It is my understanding that Mormons believe Christ was A son of God not THE son of God. If this is true, this is entirely outside the traditional Christian belief system of the first 1000 years of Christiainity, another reason why Catholic theology would define Mormonism as not Christian.
   
   Lastly, it is also my understanding, from reading Mormon doctrine and verifying this with my Mormon friends, that they believe a male can achieve a certain status and then after death, become a god of their own world and populate this world. Procreating with many women. Thus, becoming a God themselves. This too would be a very different take on Catholic doctrine. Catholics believe there is one God, 3 persons, one nature. Where one is, they all are. It is a great Christian mystery. If you go back to the Greeks, Plato and Aristotle, also not Christian, came to the conclusion that all around them comes from one source. They had different names for that source, the Good, God (not the God of Christianity) The Greeks are worth long and hard study, then to Augustine, Aquinas, Anselm. Things went crazy with Descartes and his was experiment. WOW! More on that later. Mormons and Catholic would do well to study this material.
   
   At issue here on both sides of the Christian or not argument is lack of historical study of philosophy, tradition Christian teachings like Augustine, Aquinas, etc and Mormonism. Augustine and Aquinas would not have considered Mormons Christian. It does not fit their definition, nor does it fit the Catholic definition.
   
   I am not trying to be one sided, simply stating that the Catholic theology of 2000 years, which ties in tightly with Jewish theology of 3000 years prior to that, is not congruent with saying Mormon doctrine is Christian. I know Mormons reading this will be upset, but I would encourage those Mormons to actually read the writings of the Christians from the year 70 AD to say 1500. Particularly Philosophy and Metaphysics prior to Descartes. You will see that your faith is indeed different. You may still love it and want to be a part of it, but you will at least understand the first 1500 years of Christianity and see why Catholic can’t say you are Christians by that definition. Particular study of the Trinitarian formula from this era will show the differences. The entire reason the Jews killed Jesus is because he claimed to be God. The Shema, in Judaism states, O Israel, The Lord our God, The Lord our God is one. They had a real hard time getting past the one of the Shema prayer and I can see way. The doctrine of the trinity was revealed through Christ, and was likely very shocking. Jews and Muslims aren’t Christians either by the way. CCC839 for that.
   
   I’m sorry, I have one more point, a study in the philosophical argument of contingency also would be in order and compare this to the Mormon doctrine of becoming your own God and populating this other world and being equal to the God of this world. Catholics do not and never will believe we can be equal to God, populate our own planet, etc. We believe we can be happy with God forever in paradise as his Children which starts with baptism and continues as a life of learning, faith, reason, repentance, etc. But God is the source of all, the creator, holding everything together simply by his though and if he forgot about you for a second, you would vanish, but He never will because he created you out of love, all of use, regardless of faith, and wills for us to be with him in paradise forever. This is the Catholic Journey.
   

7. Bob Kerns

   1 year ago

   I am a convert to the Catholic Church of almost five years and co-own a Catholic bookstore with a cradle Catholic couple. My Mormon wife and I manage the store.
   
   The Blessed Mother guided me on my journey home to Holy Mother Church.
   
   Prior to my conversion my family and I strove to be faithful LDS members and tried to live Christ-like lives. I was pro-life then like most of my fellow Mormons and I am even more pro-life now.
   
   While I'm sure Mr. Jones is sincere in his comments, I can say with all my heart that a vote for our current President would be a vote for the "Culture of Death".
   
   Please my dear brothers and sisters in Christ do not abstain from voting and do not vote for President Obama. The very life of our country and the public practice of our Catholic faith depends on it.
   
   I have faith that Mr. Romney will defend our country and our freedom of religion.
   
   God bless you all.
   
   

8. Bill Sr.

   1 year ago

   After reading Mr. Jones very informative article and gleening his thoughts on American politics and the conduct of the politicians we should or should not elect to lead our government I as a Catholic offer one suggestion to him, a catch phrase if you will for civil and sane citizenship by the Catholic voters he is addressing, STOP THE PLEA FOR RELIGIOUS BIGOTRY. Mr. Jones if you are this concerned for integrity and honesty from or elected officials and the need for our nation to cling to our Christian heritage as well as have them follow as closely as we can to Catholic teachings devote more time and energy to helping us removing at least the worst of the CATHOLIC congressmen and women and members of the Obama administration who are pledged advocates of the culture of death and actively campaign for laws and regulations which fly in the face of Cathollic teaching. Personally, I find your following statement.....One could argue that not voting at all in the Presidential election this cycle is really a vote for Life. Not voting would be a vote against Mitt Romney but not a cooperation with evil by supporting a Pro-Choice candidate like our current President....actually benefits those who have and continue to cooperate in the destruction of our beloved nation which you would have us believe you wish to protect. You remind us a lot of the Doug Kmeic types who helped misguided Catholics elect the current Dictator in Chief.in 2008.

9. Gerald Smith

   1 year ago

   Given that there are many members of Congress who are Catholic and are pro-abortion, I would think that the discussion here against Mormonism and Romney is rather silly. Haven't people changed views in the past? Did not Saul have a change of heart regarding Christ, and turned himself around?
   The Mormon view of abortion is that it should not be considered except for rape, incest or life of the mother; and only then after much prayer and consultation with one's bishop.
   That the Mormon view on life is somewhat different than the official Catholic view is true. That there are many Catholics who still use contraception or abortion is also true. The last time I looked, Massachusetts was a very Catholic state, and yet has some very liberal positions on abortion. As it is, as governor, Mitt Romney fought for family values, traditional marriage, etc. I'm thinking he's much closer to the orthodox Catholic position than are many Catholics! That the Mormon Church led the way on Prop 8 in California, while Catholics took a back seat, should also be noted.
   I would also suggest one consider the whole person, and not just one or two areas of consideration. While issues like abortion are very important, it is not the only issue involved here. You could have a pro-life president who bankrupts the nation, as George W Bush nearly did. There is more than one way to destroy faith, freedom, and righteousness; and to focus only on one or two issues is to neglect other sins that can ruin souls.
   This is not to say Mitt Romney is a perfect candidate. He isn't. But then neither were either Rick Santorum or Newt Gingrich (who while Catholic, definitely does not meet the standard for family values). But I believe there is enough similarity between Catholicism and Mormonism that they can both encourage and influence Mitt Romney's stances on important issues such as life and traditional marriage.

10. Will

    1 year ago

    Catholic now Mormon. And after 21 years and a Catholic education I believe I can represent both faiths quite well! I am now a LDS Bishop.
    
    Mormons are pro life! We do not take the stance that the spirit enters the body at birth! We do believe that children are not in the need of baptism, and this is perhaps wher this misconception came from..
    
    Tearing down others beliefs through misconceptions and or lies is wrong. As one Mormon who loves much of the Catholic faith, I feel sad that this individual chose to represent himself as knowledgeable Catholic.

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